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Re: Spying 201 [Re: Lil] #237566
06/04/12 11:35 AM
06/04/12 11:35 AM
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Wonderland
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If I knew what spying 101 was, I might be able to help. Sneaky SOB that I am!


Accept what is,
Let go of what was
and have faith in what will be.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: 20yrsdone] #237577
06/04/12 12:40 PM
06/04/12 12:40 PM
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Wonderland
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Can you point me to 101?


Accept what is,
Let go of what was
and have faith in what will be.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: 20yrsdone] #237688
06/04/12 08:30 PM
06/04/12 08:30 PM
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Tongue in cheek reference to MB's spying 101 thread. When this thread was started, MA was still primarily made up of former MB members


AKA Lildoggie

Just found out about your spouses affair?
Infidelity Guide For The Betrayed Spouse


Re: Spying 201 [Re: Lil] #237697
06/04/12 09:02 PM
06/04/12 09:02 PM
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Wonderland
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Wonderland
Link?


Accept what is,
Let go of what was
and have faith in what will be.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: 20yrsdone] #237981
06/05/12 09:33 PM
06/05/12 09:33 PM
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AKA Lildoggie

Just found out about your spouses affair?
Infidelity Guide For The Betrayed Spouse


Re: Spying 201 [Re: Lil] #238032
06/06/12 02:00 AM
06/06/12 02:00 AM
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Wonderland
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Thanks much Lil Doggie. I'll work on something.


Accept what is,
Let go of what was
and have faith in what will be.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: Lil] #291617
04/14/13 05:54 PM
04/14/13 05:54 PM
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I wanted to bookmark this thread about installing keyloggers. I have no idea what they are even talking about, but it all sounds very geeky -

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=492868&AP=1


"I feel sad that I focused so much on his potential and so little on mine."
Re: Spying 201 [Re: believer] #291619
04/14/13 05:56 PM
04/14/13 05:56 PM
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Especially this -
Thats why a hardware keylogger is the way to go. It is not installed in the computer at all.
See this video for how it works. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6JYt5LaaS0

Second I doubt very much anyone could actually memorize their registry it is far to complex. Odd that he digs through it so much. If your SO uses a laptop than your best bet is Spector Pro http://www.eblaster.com/spectorpro.html

Man it would be hard for anyone to find that thing, and I would think it would take months for even a trained IT guy to notice so at least you could get a few months of history.

As far as internet explorer history, he most likely is using inPrivate browsing to block his browsing habits from his history. Look at big gaps in time in his history while you know he is using it. To turn it off and on click the gear in the upper right corner of IE then click safety and then inPrivate browsing and then nothing gets recorded. Chrome is a similar feature only it is called incognito. Let me know if you need more help.

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=492868&AP=1




"I feel sad that I focused so much on his potential and so little on mine."
Re: Spying 201 [Re: believer] #292792
04/21/13 03:50 PM
04/21/13 03:50 PM
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Here's a cheap way to track a car by GPS. You can get a free app, download it to a smartphone and put it under the seat in a car.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.fsp.android.c&hl=en

It took this poster all of 30 minutes to find her husband with the OW.

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=493799


"I feel sad that I focused so much on his potential and so little on mine."
Re: Spying 201 [Re: believer] #325891
12/07/13 07:17 PM
12/07/13 07:17 PM
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It occurred to me that I never posted about my discoveries on this thread. How serendipitous! Now I will as I was able to procure $12,500 in my divorce, on my spying efforts alone. That's a nice chunk of change, in any stretch of the imagination.

It also occurs to me, however, that not everyone has the same inner strength, access, willingness or gumption, tenacity and/or possible fortuitousness to follow through with what is almost certainly going to turn out to be an extremely painful experience.

So, I'll start with a warning. This is not for the faint of heart. If you believe you are strong enough to endure the truth, read on.

Since mine was rather complicated, I'll do this is steps to make it easier for the reader. Some steps could be skipped in your particular situation, since you may have already done so, or you don't need it:

Step 1:

Check his cellphone contact list (I will use the pronoun, he or his, throughout since mine was the husband). When I finally did, there were no less than 30 female contacts on his list.

If you find any, don't call them, unless you want your spouse to know that he is busted. I did call and got hung up on more than once. It also alerted him that I was in the process of finding out things he couldn't admit to himself, let alone others.

Step: 2

Get his email password if you can. My ex's was right on the desk, next to my computer. I literally didn't know what it was. It had me stumped because he was one of those con-artist people who lived a double life. He had me believing that he was not on the Internet at all, had no email addresses and didn't use the computer. I knew it was his handwriting, however, so shoved the paper into the pencil holder next to the computer and left it there for a year before I ever used it.

There was a time (and I can't remember if it was before or after) when I was trying different passwords and user names, to no avail).

Note: A long time ago, one spouse was convicted of stalking her unfaithful spouse for using his password, in another state. But, it only happened once, that I know of. At least that is the only time I've ever heard of it, and actually is was just about the same time I was using his. But none of my attorneys, three in all ever mentioned it as wrong or illegal here. In fact, they all kept it a secret with me up until it was necessary to reveal.

Step 3:

If it is close to the time of your separation, and you have a key, go to his residence and look for anything suspicious. In my case, we owned a travel trailer together, and he took it and moved to an RV park, when he left.

In my case, I found a very suspicious-looking receipt, sitting on the kitchen table, with a paper-wait on top of it. I had no idea what it was, but it said "Green Dot" on the receipt and had a long number on this receipt. I copied down the number and kept it in a special place at home (didn't want him finding it as he still had the house key). I replaced the receipt so he wouldn't know I had been there.

I also found his cell phone, in a drawer. It had been turned off, and I was stumped. It wasn't until later on that month, when I was there again, in his company, and saw three cellphones sitting on the counter. That is when I realized he had the original one for me and a special ones for "the others."

Note: Be careful at this juncture. This is when I got beat up badly by him.

Step 4:

If you have the key to his vehicle, make sure to check it at an opportune time, when he is not aware that you are there. It was during one of these visits, when I happened to pass by while he was grocery shopping that I found more passwords, and more numbers.

Over the period of three years, I eventually collected seven numbers from those "Green Dot" receipts. (We were separated three and a half years before the divorce was final).

I had done a Google search and found out that a "Green Dot" card is a prepaid credit card. While most people use them to shop, and/or rent videos at Red box, or make purchases on the Internet, they are also used by PROSTITUTES and their Johns.

I read the VERY long disclaimer on the Green Dot site and discovered that, while they are often used for legitimate reasons, they also reserved the right to release your information in the case of legal and criminal matters. HA! That was very good for me (and you) to know.

Note: I told this story to a male friend that I'm not (thankfully) romantically involved with, not too terribly long ago. And, when I got to the part about obtaining his Green Dot numbers, my "friend" said, "He left a paper trail? That was so stupid. Never leave a paper trail." I Yi Yi.... the friends we find?????!!!!

Step 5:

Check his email accounts if you can. And, continue checking them while the separation and divorce is going on.

After finding one thread of emails that he had saved, to one of his paramours, I showed it to my girlfriend (gf). This particular set of emails was over a year old. My gf was a good sounding board. She helped me see that he "really liked" her. It was a description of how he wanted to get together with her, but she was unwilling or unable because she needed money for gas and rent and electric and phone. She itemized the monthly costs -- in a list -- in the email she wrote to him. He wrote back that he would be able to pay for her electric and gas, which was a couple of hundred dollars.

I printed that email out and saved it in my "special" spot with all the other emails that had anything to do with money or finances.

There were others, of course, too many to list. But you get the idea, right?

Step 6:

When it came time to use the Greed Dot numbers, I was not using an attorney, which was both good and bad for me. I was able to subpoena the Green Dot records, for a minimal cost of less then a few hundred dollars (can't remember the cost off the top of my head).

It revealed close to a hundred thousand dollars transferred to one woman's personal Green Dot card. He could've argued that anyone could have given her the money, but my attorney (during the deposition) explained that we had several of his numbers as well, and could place him in the general area (she called them "his stompin' grounds).

This, mind you, was only with one of the women. We had other evidence as well, which he did not dispute. We only went for $25,000 as this was the amount my attorney said she could "prove." She later came back to me, after it was all over and said, "Oh, and I found another email in his stack"(the one I outlined above). She was not a very good attorney, but the only one I could find that was not afraid to go through with the prostitution/marital waste clause. There were a few others who I know would have done it. But, their fees were out of my ballpark, sadly.

Back to what I was saying...

My attorney came to me after having a short discussion with his attorney that day. And, she said his attorney agreed to the $25,000 dollars, and was "shaking in her boots."

The reason for this is that my HUSBAND did not tell his attorney about his addiction. And, my attorney informed me that he was still denying it all the way up to the day we got the divorce.

I suspect he's still in denial, and we've been divorced now for two and a half (2 1/2) years.

Note: I live in Florida, which is an "equitable distribution" state. One of the divorce clauses says that any "marital assets" which includes money, is subject to Marital Waste, if it can be proven. Marital Waste is any wasted money by one spouse who uses the marital money for one of three addictions: Sex, Drugs or Gambling. In the case of marital waste, the betrayed spouse is entitled to half of the money wasted, in my case it was the sex addiction that obviously, was key.

There now. This is my contribution to the Spying 101 thread. Happy reading!


I thank God for all the times he saved my life, for putting all the people in my path who helped save it, and all the other people I met along the way.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: poet] #326024
12/09/13 04:37 PM
12/09/13 04:37 PM
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A keylogger was literally a life changing $100 purchase for me. I was TERRIFIED of installing it...my XH is a programmer and I just knew he would instantly know what I had done. He had his lap top in a hard case briefcase...'locked' but he was lazy and had failed to roll the number one time so I knew what the code was.

The single biggest thing that I did that was helpful was to continue to collect evidence for WEEKS after I discovered the affair. This enabled me to find proof that he had indeed also had an affair with my cousin 7 years prior to him being busted for the affair with his co-worker. I cannot stress how difficult this was because I had a 9 year old child to continue caring for, as well as pretend like nothing was wrong and at the same time refuse sex without setting off his suspicions...it was a crazy time. True to what I had been told though, he was too deep in his affair fog to notice anything I was doing. Toward the end of my survellience period I began to play little games just to see if I could make him realize he was busted. He was clueless.

Re: Spying 201 [Re: SmilingWife] #326026
12/09/13 04:41 PM
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One mistake I made was trying to hire a PI out of the phone book. Big mistake and he was a huge waste of my time. I ended up not paying him a dime. I would have had he pressed the issue, but honestly he was worthless....oh wait I remember now I asked him for a written report of what he had discovered and he never produced it so I never paid.

My attorney told me if I had asked him he would have recommended a good one...I didn't even think of that. Naturally a divorce attorney would know who the good PIs are. Duh.

The good news is I was able to gather enough evidence on my own it didn't matter. I identified the OW, her husband, her parents. Her BW was a huge help to me...he gave me her address (she had recently left him and he didn't know she was having an affair) and her parents address.

Re: Spying 201 [Re: SmilingWife] #326279
12/11/13 07:40 PM
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Getting back to the GreenDot card, how to spy on it and how to recover from its discovery, it is important to know that if you happen to be in the invisible part of the MA population where people don't know about it or don't care about it because it is not "part of their world," please don't get discouraged.

You CAN recover from it. It takes a while, but if you're a strong person and you have strong boundaries, you will overcome any hurtful or hateful comments.

It was extremely painful for me to discover that:

(1). This world even existed. I shouldn't have had to know about these things.

(2). This world had now become a part of my world.

(3). Most people won't even acknowledge it, let alone try to console you, the victim, in spite of it.

People are just not built that way. It takes a mountain of understanding to understand how a victim would feel in light of the knowledge that her spouse has not only cheated on her, but has done so, in such a way as to alienate others from her life; to put her own life at risk and to cast her into a pool of invisible victims who neither understand what happened nor how to begin to heal.

But, it can be done. Peace!


I thank God for all the times he saved my life, for putting all the people in my path who helped save it, and all the other people I met along the way.
Re: Spying 201 [Re: poet] #326394
12/12/13 07:58 PM
12/12/13 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Be careful at this juncture. This is when I got beat up badly by him.


Oh Poet.

I am so sorry this happened to you and that all the things were so terribly ugly for you. I'm also glad you are not married to him anymore.

I confess I'm one of those people who has been pretty ignorant of the kind of ugliness your ex. imposed on your life.

Thank you for sharing a few things you learned from that awful time that might be helpful for others.

I'm wondering if you might think about writing an article about the "ugly underbelly" of certain kinds of infidelity or something...

Just a thought.

Glad you're back.


Married 13 years
D10
D5
Re: Spying 201 [Re: Telly] #343091
04/05/14 11:41 PM
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Here's spyware for the phone that seems to be good -

http://www.mspy.com/features.html?gclid=CJb9j5TByr0CFUFufgod2nAA-A

Not only does it show you texts and phone calls, but records the surrounding conversations -

"I found a feature on the spyware that allows me to record his surroundings for intervals of 30 minutes per hour. I set it up to record just the night time hours and I've already caught the following exchanges.

1. "My wife has gained so much weight. I wish I could show you guys a picture of how hot she use to be " (um...I just had a baby and I'm still very slender)

2. I heard him flirting with a stripper and they giggled about both being married.

3. He had a random conversation with a man at the bar who told my husband his story of being unfaithful and losing the love of his life...his wife. My husband said...well your real mistake was getting caught.

4. Much talk of sexually vulgar things with his buddies.

I feel like it's just not enough to leave him. Oh my goodness...how did I get here? I have no respect for myself and clearly he doesn't respect me either. Is this man flawed on a character deep level or do all men act like this when their partners aren't around? All the guys with him were speaking multiple times on sexual affair type things and they're all married too."

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=527424

Last edited by believer; 04/05/14 11:42 PM.

"I feel sad that I focused so much on his potential and so little on mine."
Re: Spying 201 [Re: believer] #343208
04/07/14 02:16 AM
04/07/14 02:16 AM
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Originally Posted By: believer
Here's spyware for the phone that seems to be good -

http://www.mspy.com/features.html?gclid=CJb9j5TByr0CFUFufgod2nAA-A

Not only does it show you texts and phone calls, but records the surrounding conversations -

"I found a feature on the spyware that allows me to record his surroundings for intervals of 30 minutes per hour. I set it up to record just the night time hours and I've already caught the following exchanges.

1. "My wife has gained so much weight. I wish I could show you guys a picture of how hot she use to be " (um...I just had a baby and I'm still very slender)

2. I heard him flirting with a stripper and they giggled about both being married.

3. He had a random conversation with a man at the bar who told my husband his story of being unfaithful and losing the love of his life...his wife. My husband said...well your real mistake was getting caught.

4. Much talk of sexually vulgar things with his buddies.

I feel like it's just not enough to leave him. Oh my goodness...how did I get here? I have no respect for myself and clearly he doesn't respect me either. Is this man flawed on a character deep level or do all men act like this when their partners aren't around? All the guys with him were speaking multiple times on sexual affair type things and they're all married too."

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=527424


Wow. No way I would try to stay married to someone like that. He is no good.

Re: Spying 201 [Re: SmilingWife] #412149
07/19/16 08:45 PM
07/19/16 08:45 PM
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Bumping this so it can be amended.

Snooping, Spying and Looking for Truth

In an ideal world, where every marriage is totally open and honest and only what is best for our spouse and our relationship is the primary motivation for everything that we do, snooping becomes irrelevant. If your spouse knows everything you do and you know everything he or she does, even when you are apart, snooping is not only pointless, but can also damage the relationship. Under such conditions it undermines trust rather than creates it. Without a specific target or reason for snooping, the act itself does not give comfort or build trust because not finding anything incriminating doesnt prove that you have no cause for mistrust and when your snooping is discovered, which it eventually will be, the lack of trust will prove more about your own dissatisfaction with the relationship than anything your spouse might have done to make you look for evidence of broken trust.

There are some who become addicted to the activities involved in snooping. It can give you quite a rush of adrenaline to hack into her email or work around that new pattern lock on his phone. As you sneak into the bedroom while he watches the game to dig through his pockets and read every scrap of paper you can find in his wallet, it can give you quite a sense of power. As you eavesdrop on her phone conversation with the mother of another child on your childs soccer team, it can feel like you are gaining insight into some secret place. It makes you feel extraordinary and special. It makes you a super-hero with special powers.

Power, control and manipulation is what this sort of snooping is usually about. For some it leads to a false sense of security if nothing serious is found; while for others lack of evidence only makes them want to look harder and dig deeper. If you are snooping and find nothing you should be concerned about but keep looking, absent other evidence of a secret life, your lack of trust might be more about something that is an issue you need to deal with in yourself or your own emotional responses to the current state of your relationship.

Ive even know a few who searched for evidence of wrong doing by their spouse for the purpose of justifying their own betrayal of the marriage.

Privacy vs Secrecy

We all, as individuals, expect and demand a certain level of privacy. When that privacy is violated we respond unfavorably or even violently. We feel vulnerable, exposed, perhaps even betrayed. If that privacy is violated by someone we are close to, the betrayal can be especially damaging to the relationship.

But there is also the other side of privacy related to keeping secrets from others. Privacy is about having your own thoughts and your own fears. It has to do with not revealing the worst of ourselves. Its closing the door to use the bathroom or take a shower. Its having your own friends, your own job, your own dreams and your own sense of self.

All secrets are private but not all privacy is keeping secrets. Secrets are things kept private in order to deceive others. They are about balance of power or maintaining the status quo. Secrets are kept hidden so that others might not see the real self.

Secrets are often justified by claiming that they are hidden for the protection of self or others. In business, in national security, even in daily life, like when you take a vacation, not everything has to be posted on social media for the whole world to see but if you are keeping a secret because your spouse would be hurt if they knew you were doing what is being hidden, why would you be doing something that you know would hurt your spouse to begin with?

In marriage, there should always be privacy. Seldom does secrecy prove beneficial to the person from whom the information is being withheld. Generally, a secret kept only benefits the person or group keeping it. It might, in such instances, be to the benefit of the one being kept in the dark, and perhaps even to the relationship itself to discover things kept hidden in order to know how to respond. Under such circumstances, snooping may be the only viable way to know information that is crucial to your own life and well being.

This debate even plays out in our political discourse. We want the government to snoop on bad guys to keep us safe but dont want them listening to our phone calls because our personal calls are private. Sometimes they are also full of secrets though many are more likely to be a threat to our marriage than to national security.


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Spying 201 [Re: Mark1952] #412181
07/20/16 03:50 PM
07/20/16 03:50 PM
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Is Snooping Legal?

The simple answer to this question is that there is no simple answer. What you do to snoop, what you do with the information you discover and a whole host of other factors can be applied to this question and some of those factors can vary a great deal depending on where you live. In the US, federal, state and in some cases even local laws apply. Judicial precedent can also have an impact.

A Michigan man was involved in a divorce and suspected his wife of infidelity. She had been married three times and her affair was with husband #2. He accessed her email account and printed them out and attempted to introduce them as evidence in court. He also shared them with husband #1 who was engaged in a custody struggle with the woman.

Sounds like sweet revenge, doesn't it? It didn't go so well, however, and the man was charged with what amounts to illegal hacking.

A lot of things can be done to gather information that are not illegal but even those methods of snooping might get you into trouble with the law depending on what you actually do with what you get by doing it.

Recording Phone Calls

As of this writing, there are 38 states and the District of Columbia that have what is called single party consent. That is, as long as one party is aware that the conversation is being recorded and has given consent, the recording is considered legal. This means that you can record conversations between you and your spouse, or between you and another person. What it also means is that you cannot record a conversation between other people unless at least one of them has given consent to being recorded and knows they are being recorded.

Twelve states currently have all party consent for recording. This means that in these states, everyone involved in the conversation must be aware that it is being recorded and give actual consent. These "two-party consent" laws have been adopted in California, Connecticut, Florida, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania and Washington.

The Illinois law is in question and a court ruled that it was unconstitutional in 2014. Hawaii is actually a one party state but requires all party consent if the recording device is installed in a private place. This might include even your own home or car, so before installing a recording device in Hawaii, seek legal counsel. The Massachusetts law prohibits "secret" recordings rather than requiring specific consent from each party. Hidden recording devices that some or all people present are not aware of will probably cause you more trouble than any information gained would give you an advantage.

In most cases, who initiates the call, who owns the phone or place the recording is being made and probably a hundred other factors might be involved. My recommendation is that if you live in a one party state and want to record conversations with your spouse, you ae probably free to do so. If you live in one of the all party states or Hawaii, secret recordings could be more trouble than they are worth.

In other countries, the laws can vary. In India, for example, no recording of a telephone call can be made without approval from the designated authority. Germany requires all party consent while Denmark only requires single party consent.

There are even a few laws on the books in the US and elsewhere that prohibit in person eavesdropping by attempting to overhear a conversation. In most cases in the US, if the conversation is loud enough to be heard "through a wall" or even through the HVAC system, it is permissible to listen to it. What you do with the information you gather might be a different story.

Recording Video

So far, video seems to be less regulated than audio recording. Devices such as nanny-cams that can be easily concealed, often left in plain sight, can usually be installed in your own home. There is a twist to the laws covering these devices however. You can usually record video in your own home, recreational vehicle and perhaps even your vehicle as long as you are not recording the audio. As soon as audio is part of the recording, the consent laws seem to take precedence. This is why most "nanny-cams" don't have microphones.

Where you install a video recording device can also get you into trouble, especially if it indiscriminately records everyone entering or leaving a space. Obviously, installing a camera in the bathroom could be hard to explain to a judge. As long as you keep the camera in the living room, kitchen or other public areas, you are probably safe. The bedroom might be a bit of a stretch in some states, but what you actually do with the recording probably matters more than where the camera is hidden.

Email, Messaging, Electronic Media

If your spouse has shared his or her password for their email account and has given you permission to access that email, legally, you are probably safe unless the password gets changed or access is denied directly. "Guessing" the email password is not the same as it being shared with you. That guy in Michigan "guessed" his wife's password and is in some pretty serious trouble.

For most purposes, other forms of electronic written communication are like email. If you already have legal access it remains until rescinded or the password gets changed. The laws regarding this type of access are starting to be applied to electronic storage as well. Whether hardware or cloud storage doesn't seem to be the criteria for legality.

If the email account or the device it is accessed with belong to a third party, I suggest you simply stay away from it. As tempting as snooping on his work computer or employer provided cellular phone might be, getting caught will land you in some serious hot water. If you get information that you can't act on without getting arrested, breaking the law to get it is probably not in your best interest.

It might be legal to access email through an email client or program installed on a family or shared computer, or one that belongs to you but gets used by your spouse on occasion,and for which you are the administrator and that allows access without entering a password to run the program. As courts start ruling on this sort of thing, the legality of such snooping could change quickly. Again I will stress that accessing the employer's email system or email service is likely to not end well. So just decide that the work email is off limits unless you like orange coveralls and shoes without laces.

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Break
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mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
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