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Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! #45220
01/05/11 05:00 PM
01/05/11 05:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,227
Puppy Dog Tails Offline OP
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Puppy Dog Tails  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,227

My Story:

I actually had two main confrontations with my wife. Initially, I had suspicions, based on the way she was acting and some of the things she was googling on the computer (I had a keylogger). Naturally, she denied it -- twice.

This was during the Summer of 2007.

Then one night I was out of town, at my dad's 80th birthday party, and she stayed home with the kids. I got an e-mail on my BlackBerry from my keylogger, showing that she was searching "older woman/younger man" and "sexual positions" etc. on the home computer. I felt sick to my stomach, and like an ox was standing on my chest. I couldn't breathe, and I didn't know if I should tell my folks and my siblings, or try to keep it to myself.

I was up all night, distraught, and phoned my wife and confronted her around midnight. "You're up late," I said. "Yeah, I couldn't sleep," she replied. She sounded nervous. "What are you doing?" I asked, and she could tell something was wrong. "Just on the computer," she said. "What's wrong?"

(pause)

"Look, I know all about you and (OM's first name), and it needs to stop. Immediately. This is incredibly disrespectful to me, to our marriage, and to our family." She tried to deny it at first, but I persisted (without revealing my intel), saying "Please STOP IT. We both know you're lying to me right now, and it's horribly disrespectful. If you're going to lie to me, I'm just going to hang up."

She then SORT of told me the truth, denying that it had become physical (which I later found out was also a lie).

I exposed to our adult daughters that night, via a phone call. My D-then-18 already knew, as she had suspected something and her and her best friend had followed her mother one night a couple of weeks ago, and caught her coming out of a bar with the guy, and saw them get into a car together. The poor thing had been keeping this all to herself, because she didn't want to upset her daddy. She broke down on the phone and cried, and so did I.

I told both her and her sister (D-then-20) that I loved their mother very much, did NOT want a divorce, but I also wasn't going tolerate this kind of disrespect. I WOULD NOT LIVE IN AN OPEN MARRIAGE. They both said they understood, and respected my position. D18 wanted to confront OM that next day, and I talked her down, and told them both just to wait until I got back from my trip and we could discuss it as a family.

I also exposed to my parents and siblings the next morning, as I felt I needed their support. In the ensuing couple of weeks, I gave my wife repeated chances to end the affair -- she refused 5-6x -- and then I finally exposed to her parents, OM's parents (he lived with his parents!) and their employer, on whose premises the affair was partly taking place. Since the kid was also studying to become a cop, and was going thru the Academy, I found out that there was a "public review" process and I wrote a letter to his file, exposing their affair, and opposing his candidacy to become a police officer.

About 50 days in, I filed for divorce, after she repeatedly threatened to divorce ME. I felt I needed to protect myself, and decided to go for full custody of our boys.

Despite all of this, and my tightening the finances to stop paying for anything that was enabling her affair (cellphone, plastic surgery payment, haircoloring, etc.), her affair continued -- heated up -- for 60 days. I then RE-confronted her, with the "NO MORE DECEIT" confrontation (it's all in my old Chocolateeyes threads; Summer of 2007). This re-confrontation took place in her car, in a department store parking lot, when I told her one evening that "we need to talk." I had decided that while I may not be able to stop her from having an affair, I damned sure wasn't going to let her continue to LIE about it to her parents and to our adult daughters, and try to say that I was being "paranoid" and accusing HER, when everything I was claiming was 100% TRUE.

I told her at this meeting "you either tell them, or I will, and I will show them my evidence."

I gave her 5 minutes to decide.

She told them.

It took about another month before she fully ended it and begged me to take her back, but make no mistake -- that night was basically the beginning of the death of her affair. She had one backslide, about 2 weeks into no-contact/transparency, which she self-confessed, and we got thru it. After two 3-month "stays" of the divorce action, I finally withdrew it the following Spring.

We had fits and starts over the next couple of years, nearing divorce twice (even met with the mediator), ending with a mutually-agreed-upon separation this summer, where we would try to date each other, but each would date other people (she had initially INSISTED on this, and I initially said it was a DEALBREAKER. I then changed my mind, based mostly on Gucci's and Robx's stuff on here). Not two weeks into that arrangement, she called me in tears (I was on my one and only "date"), and long story short, I moved back in with her and we agreed to MC and we fully reconciled.

We've had some tough moments, but our marriage is stronger than it's ever been. The MC is fantastic (had been my wife's IC), holds our feet to the fire, and we're finally starting to deal with some of our sex-starved marriage issues and my wife's problems with intimacy. (***EDIT: this ugly monster has re-reared its head since I wrote this) Turns out MWD's books (along with Harley, Glass and some of my other faves) were all over the MC's office! I knew I had found the right place for us. My wife and I are better friends than we have ever been, have ML more in the past 3 months than we had in the past six YEARS (***EDIT -- ditto; this has returned to SSM state), and I'd say we are "Piecing" at this point, to use the DB phrase.

I hope that helps. That's an awfully long answer to a short question, but I thought I'd just put it all out there.

Puppy

I should add as a P.S.

Throughout all of these "tough stances," I maintained a "loving detachment" towards my wayward wife. Oh, we had our moments -- three or four real blow-ups -- but for the most part, we managed to keep things civil. I laid out some boundaries (no family finances used to enable your affair, no TMing or phoning OM from inside our home, no TMing or phoning OM in front of our sons, from ANYWHERE, if you're going to come home after 1am, don't bother coming home, etc.), and I must say, she respected them almost completely.

The "loving" part of "loving detachment" comes easier for you, trust me, when you maintain full intel ("snooping") and you hear and see the things that I heard and saw. But I did try to "shine a light back towards the marriage, even as I never wavered from my Main Boundary ("I will not live in an open marriage") and my sub-boundaries mentioned above. I would do occasional loving Acts of Service for my wife, such as pulling her car in the garage late at nite, or covering her with a blanket when she fell asleep on the couch, kissing her on the forehead, etc.

I believe that this "hybrid" approach -- aggressive confrontation & exposure, firm boundaries, cut off all financial enabling, strong legal stance; coupled with DBing principles such as GAL, "be the better option," 180s, etc. -- is what works best when there is active infidelity involved.

Reasonable people may disagree, but this is what worked for me, and this is also what I have seen work in my time on these boards, as well as my study of literally thousands of affairs.

Puppy


Drink the koffee, not the Kool-Aid.
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #45229
01/05/11 05:21 PM
01/05/11 05:21 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,959
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D4MIL Offline
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D4MIL  Offline
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did you ever find out why she did what she did?

i could be in a fog but i've always thought that SSM was as "real" as an MLC. in other words, it's just a label with no real scientific data to back it up.

my stbxh would say we were in a SSM. but dig deep and you'll find that there was another cause .. an EN was not being met. once you start meeting those needs, the level of dopamine in the brain surges and your partner begins to look attractive .. it sets off a chain reaction .. a la Helen Fisher.

could that be something in your sitch? maybe an EN is not being met?

Last edited by DumpedforMIL; 01/05/11 05:32 PM.
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: D4MIL] #45243
01/05/11 05:51 PM
01/05/11 05:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,227
Puppy Dog Tails Offline OP
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Puppy Dog Tails  Offline OP
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She said she succumbed to the affair because she felt I was neglecting her. I intentionally stopped meeting her ENs, because she was never meeting any of mine.


Drink the koffee, not the Kool-Aid.
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #45246
01/05/11 06:02 PM
01/05/11 06:02 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,883
Gateway to the West
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Not2fun Offline
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Gateway to the West
Originally Posted By: Puppy Dog Tails
She said she succumbed to the affair because she felt I was neglecting her. I intentionally stopped meeting her ENs, because she was never meeting any of mine.


The merry-go-round I bet nearly ALL of us have been on, especially pre-A's....

Thanks for doing this PDT.....I really appreciate it!!

Not2fun



" If you couldn't change your partner when you were together, you sure aren't going to now that you aren't together..." Words of the teacher of the court mandated parenting class...and the ONE thing that stuck out to me!!!
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Not2fun] #45256
01/05/11 06:23 PM
01/05/11 06:23 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 72
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SpinFree Offline
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SpinFree  Offline
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Puppy,

I hear ya.
We are working on turning around our SSM.

It's been getting better. I was a total NG. I was so angry and frustrated. Now I'm learning to lead our family. (I fixed my issues.)

My wife has intimacy issues. They aren't mine to fix. She'll fix them or she won't. If she doesn't there won't be a 20th anniversary trip because there won't be a 20th anniversary. She knows this. Your wife seems like she needs consequences too.


SF

Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #45276
01/05/11 06:41 PM
01/05/11 06:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,959
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D4MIL Offline
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Quote:
She said she succumbed to the affair because she felt I was neglecting her. I intentionally stopped meeting her ENs, because she was never meeting any of mine.

i think this is how most problems arise.

what are you and mrs. pdt doing now to meet each others' ENs?

i'm glad your marriage is back on track.

Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Not2fun] #45307
01/05/11 07:20 PM
01/05/11 07:20 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 55
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maple Offline
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Originally Posted By: Not2fun
Originally Posted By: Puppy Dog Tails
She said she succumbed to the affair because she felt I was neglecting her. I intentionally stopped meeting her ENs, because she was never meeting any of mine.


The merry-go-round I bet nearly ALL of us have been on, especially pre-A's....

Thanks for doing this PDT.....I really appreciate it!!

Not2fun



It is hard work trying to keep off that merry go round. Every once in awhile I find myself slipping and getting lazy... just the other night H and I sat down, talked and agreed we need to get back on track and work towards the marriage we both want to have.


Me: 43, STBXH: 43
2 DD: 7 & 5

Together: 17 Married: 10
Jan 2010- Piecing
Feb 2013 - Separated
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: SpinFree] #45391
01/05/11 08:38 PM
01/05/11 08:38 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,227
Puppy Dog Tails Offline OP
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Puppy Dog Tails  Offline OP
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Posts: 2,227
Originally Posted By: SpinFree
Your wife seems like she needs consequences too.




Ultimately, I filed for divorce (I told her that her affair was only the "final straw" of a sexless marriage). We reconciled (which included a good and frequent sex life).

Once you've played that -- the ultimate card -- there's not much more in the way of "consequences" that one has to play.

Puppy


Drink the koffee, not the Kool-Aid.
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #45654
01/06/11 12:42 AM
01/06/11 12:42 AM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,821
flowmom Offline
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flowmom  Offline
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PDT, thanks for sharing your story. You've helped so many with your advice, but I'm guessing that even more will be helped by seeing the human behind the "all-knowing vet". It's been a very challenging journey, and it sounds like you're still in the process of regaining a healthy marriage.

I've been on both sides of a SSM, and IME it's painful for both parties no matter what side you're on. I'll share my experience in case it would be helpful for you.

I have experienced low libido at specific times in my life, both during a major depression (ending 14 years ago) and during the year after my babies were born (breastfeeding hormones). During those times, I rarely initiated and sometimes (but not always) refused. STBXH needed reassurance that I was really "into" ML with him, so it didn't work for him to coax me into getting in the mood. That's unfortunately because some connecting conversation, patient foreplay, and easing of pressure to be fully "into it" would have helped me to relax to get there. If we had kept our sex life going, even imperfectly, it would have made a big difference in the long run. He really took my low libido times personally, which is understandable and unfortunate because I always desired him, just couldn't always tune into it.

For the last six years of our M, I was the "high desire partner" in our M. I believe that it was because STBXH was depressed, sleep-deprived, and not feeling emotionally safe in the M (and not willing to do any personal work to deal with any marriage issues). There may have been one or more affairs involved on his part, but I'll never know. He certainly had ample opportunity. It was horrible to live in near-celibacy...I felt that I couldn't be me in the M, because my sexuality is part of who I am.

There are two teachers who probably could have helped STBXH and I resolve our marriage problems, including the sexual ones.

1. Al Turtle
I have recently started studying his (free!) articles and participating in his threads here on MA. I am blown away by his combination of solid theory, clear communication, and practical advice. I think his teachings could have helped us with the power struggle/communication problems/unmet needs/feeling unsafe issues that were underlying a lot of the SSM stuff.

2. David Deida
The Way of the Superior Man: A Spiritual Guide to Mastering the Challenges of Women, Work, and Sexual Desire
http://www.amazon.com/Way-Superior-Man-Spiritual-Challenges/dp/1591792576/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
This is a great book that I would recommend to any man. A lot of men would benefit from the "manning up" part of the book, but I know that's not your problem wink . Where I think the book is also very helpful is he explains very clearly (in "man talk") how to manage women, their emotions, and their communications.

book table of contents:
Quote:
part one: A MAN'S WAY
1. Stop Hoping for a Completion of Anything in Life
2. Live With an Open Heart Even If It Hurts
3. Live As If Your Father Were Dead
4. Know Your Real Edge and Don't Fake It
5. Always Hold To Your Deepest Realization
6. Never Change Your Mind Just to Please a Woman
7. Your Purpose Must Come Before Your Relationship
8. Lean Just Beyond Your Edge
9. Do It for Love
10. Enjoy Your Friends' Criticism
11. If You Don't Know Your Purpose, Discover it, Now
12. Be Willing to Change Everything in Your Life
13. Don't Use Your Family As an Excuse
14. Don't Get Lost in Tasks and Duties
15. Stop Hoping for Your Woman to Get Easier

part two: DEALING WITH WOMEN
16. Women Are Not Liars
17. Praise Her
18. Tolerating Her Leads to Resenting Her
19. Don't Analyze Your Woman
20. Don't Suggest that a Woman Fix Her Own Emotional Problem
21. Stay With Her Intensity&emdash;To a Point
22. Don't Force the Feminine to Make Decisions

part three: WORKING WITH POLARITY AND ENERGY
23. Your Attraction To the Feminine Is Inevitable
24. Choose a Woman Who Is Your Complimentary Opposite
25. Know What Is Important in Your Woman
26. You Will Often Want More Than One Woman
27. Young Women Offer You a Special Energy
28. Each Woman Has a "Temperature" That Can Heal or Irritate You

part four: WHAT WOMEN REALLY WANT
29. Choose a Woman Who Chooses You
30. What She Wants Is Not What She Says
31. Her Complaint Is Content-Free
32. She Doesn't Really Want to Be Number One
33. Your Excellent Track Record Is Meaningless to Her
34. She Wants to Relax in the Demonstration of Your Direction

part five: YOUR DARK SIDE
35. You Are Always Searching for Freedom
36. Own Your Darkest Desires
37. She Wants the "Killer" in You
38. She Needs Your Consciousness to Match Her Energy

part six: FEMININE ATTRACTIVENESS
39. The Feminine Is Abundant
40. Allow Older Women Their Magic
41. Turn Your Lust Into Gifts
42. Never Allow Your Desire to Become Suppressed or Depolarized
43. Use Her Attractiveness as a Slingshot Through Appearance

part seven: BODY PRACTICES
[x-rated ;)]

part eight: MEN'S AND WOMEN'S YOGA OF INTIMACY
47. Take into Account the Primary Asymmetry
48. You Are Responsible for the Growth in Intimacy
49. Insist on Practice and Growth
50. Restore Your Purpose in Solitude and with Other Men
51. Practice Dissolving


we: me44 + my husband Pookie :9: + S9 + D6
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: flowmom] #45695
01/06/11 02:28 AM
01/06/11 02:28 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 135
Calgary, Alberta
CD Bear Offline
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Hi Puppy-
Thanks for posting! I will also say that I am happy to hear you continue to make progress in reconciliation.

All about TIME, isn't it? And consistent actions/behaviours.

I also agree with Flow on the Deida book (though he leans a little 'transcendental/Sting' at the end.

And I am also really enjoying delving deeper into Al Turtles stuff. I find it really fills in some blanks I've felt throughout this journey.

My M was also sexless for the last year before the bomb. I knew there was more to it than the sex but she clearly didn't. She saw that as the dealbreaker EN not being met and it was obviously ENTIRELY my fault.

You are SO far ahead of me in this this that all I can offer is support and encouragement.

I will keep up on your thread and continue to learn from you in hopes I may one day have the opportunity to make use of your reconciliation experience.

Thanks, PDT.

More than I could ever say.



M48
W30
D3
T6
M4
ILYBNILWY 04/10
Bomb 05/10 Bad MC!!
Exposure 07/14/10
Living seperately since then.
(StbX w OM)
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #45856
01/06/11 02:35 PM
01/06/11 02:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,535
Ace Offline
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Ace  Offline
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Posts: 3,535
Thanks for posting your story, Puppy and I'm glad Not2Fun suggested it.

Success Stories are often difficult to write but can be therapeutic. They're also very inspiring for posters AND lurkers alike.

Thanks,
Ace

P.S. I was a bit confused when I looked up the SSM acronym on the abbreviations list on the Welcome forum, but saw that the meaning posted there was "Same Sex Marriage." eek I'm glad you posted the words "Sex-Starved Marriage" to enlighten me and possibly other posters. It would be helpful if you or other DB posters could notify the mods of duplicate meanings that should be added to the list. I was also confused on another thread and did not know that ML meant Making Love. Many MB posters may have not known that either as it's referred to on MB as SF for Sexual Fulfillment. Again, Thanks.


Last edited by Ace; 01/06/11 02:40 PM. Reason: add link to list of abbreviations

We're overcoming decades of marital dysfunction including abuse, passive aggression, gas-lighting & infidelity (both of us).

Our Weird and Ongoing Story
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: flowmom] #47461
01/08/11 05:58 PM
01/08/11 05:58 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,821
flowmom Offline
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PDT, sorry for posting advice in this thread. I missed at first that it's the Success Stories forum and now it's too late to edit my post.


we: me44 + my husband Pookie :9: + S9 + D6
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: flowmom] #50722
01/13/11 09:52 PM
01/13/11 09:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,227
Puppy Dog Tails Offline OP
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Puppy Dog Tails  Offline OP
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Flow,

Never apologize for trying to help someone. It's what makes you the great and caring person you are! smile

Puppy


Drink the koffee, not the Kool-Aid.
Re: Still Struggling with a SSM, but Affair-Busting WORKS!! [Re: Puppy Dog Tails] #51614
01/15/11 04:23 PM
01/15/11 04:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
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OurHouse Offline
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Hi Puppy:

I haven't ventured too much into this particular forum (I feel very far from "success" so I ignore this forum...LOL) but I came here looking for something to copy/paste for Belle. I stopped to read your story. Thanks for posting it.

So many people here are being touched by Al's writings. I count myself among them.



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